Anyway, the Romans were certainly equal opportunity crucifiers. If you weren’t a citizen, you could as easily be crucified as anything else. Roman citizens got the honor of being beheaded.
It’s my understanding that Roman standards for punishment were: for Romans whipped with a rod 9 or so times, and beheaded for more serious crimes.
For Greeks and other none Jews was 40 lashes.
For Jews it was normally over 100 lashes with things like Cat-o-nine tails, often times fatal.
dkram: I was unaware of those distinctions in Roman judicial practice, particularly that Jews were singled out for punishment by scourging. (The Romans were generally equal-opportunity torturers, if you didn’t happen to be a Roman citizen.) What are your sources?
Oh, yeah…infrastructure. :) Roads are critical to building a coherent society, yes. But the resources have to be there to build and maintain them, as well as secure them, or commerce will not result.
The Romans built their roads across their empire primarily for military purposes, and they imposed whatever taxes were needed to accomplish it. I wonder if the Afghans are ready for their central government to do that.
Well, infrastructure has many dimensions. The Roman punishments weren’t any more frequent or cruel than anyone else’s at the time, and in fact can be considered more “civilized” than others since they had an beaurocratic and consistant method of administering them. As Havoc says, the crosses came along with the roads.
Funny how what goes around, comes around. Ever see those 5-star “Eisenhower Interstate System” signs on the highway? All we’re missing are the crosses…
The “Eisenhower Interstate System” did more to raise costs of produce than almost anything else. Trucks can not compete cost affectively with trains. Also how many small towns were destroyed by being bypassed by the highway system. Truck manafacturers, tire manufactuters and the oil companies were behind the highway system.
Being retired anyway I try to take back roads when possible.
The interstate highway system did wonders for my city. One highway divided us along racial and income lines. Another separated the city from our river, a source of transportation and recreation. But the designers were thrifty, they built on cheaper municipal land, parks and open space. Now we hear the rumble of out of state traffic that neither stops for gas nor food but leaves a ton of pollutants. Nobody shops in the city now, it is too easy to stay away in the burbs and burn their gas.
I’m from MI so anything that sells cars and gives them places to burn up lots of fuel going fast is fine with me. TX and MI share those interests. (;-)
Before, you couldn’t get to those small towns without hours of driving through other small towns with speed traps and 25 mph limits. One can still drive the “Irish Hills” into Detroit and spend many more hours that way than on the interstates. If you like it, it isn’t dead at all. Rt 66 made a great trip and TV show.
Ike created the freeways to open the land cause he saw the value of roads from his experience in WWII. We can now get to most places, even those dreaded small towns, very quickly and even a small access road and our fine new communications systems makes a cheap warehouse system viable. Ike even warned us about the military-industrial complex well in advance. One of our finest in service to his country all around.
The railway system still works, with it’s featherbedding, it’s separate worker’s comp system, it’s separate EVERYTHING. Not the pure capitalist solution it’s being made out to be here.
You should have seen the Roman’s punishment for political cartoonists. You were chained to a rock and had to explain every cartoon you drew to passers by.
Eisenhower’s main purpose in funding and creating the Interstates was so that the government could ferry tanks and troops around at a moment’s notice, mobilizing against the imminent Soviet invasion. If it cut down on your ride to grandma’s house on Thanksgiving, so much the better.
Today’s Roman roads are the “Information Superhighway”, which was initially funded as a federal project to move data around between defense contractors. Sending personal e-mails, etc. was an afterthought. The Golden Arches have replaced the crosses on the highways… but where are the crosses on the internet highway?
Romans actually stole the cross from the Persians who stole it from the Phoenicians who stole it from…Goes back as far as Taurus (T) worship and sacrificing humans on it for that God’s good graces. Roman never had an original idea but did a good job of stealing them from everyone else and “improving” them.
Larry, The Interstate road system also made more produce available. Speaking of fresh vegetable produce, it is generally cheaper to transport to more places quicker through the Interstate system.
The Roman justice system was fairer than some today.
“The Romans built their roads across their empire primarily for military purposes, and they imposed whatever taxes were needed to accomplish it. I wonder if the Afghans are ready for their central government to do that.”
Not sure the Americans are ready for a central government, let alone one that might impose taxes to accomplish building (or even maintaining) roads – the roads in Michigan are the worst in the country and there’s no money or will to fix them.
rayannina over 14 years ago
Oh sure, Havoc - accentuate the negative!
Steve Bartholomew over 14 years ago
It wasn’t slaves, it was Christians, so that’s ok.
cdward over 14 years ago
^Not very nice, Sheik.
Anyway, the Romans were certainly equal opportunity crucifiers. If you weren’t a citizen, you could as easily be crucified as anything else. Roman citizens got the honor of being beheaded.
Dkram over 14 years ago
It’s my understanding that Roman standards for punishment were: for Romans whipped with a rod 9 or so times, and beheaded for more serious crimes. For Greeks and other none Jews was 40 lashes. For Jews it was normally over 100 lashes with things like Cat-o-nine tails, often times fatal.
\\//_
peter0423 over 14 years ago
dkram: I was unaware of those distinctions in Roman judicial practice, particularly that Jews were singled out for punishment by scourging. (The Romans were generally equal-opportunity torturers, if you didn’t happen to be a Roman citizen.) What are your sources?
SuperGriz over 14 years ago
So… we’re not gonna discuss infrastructure?
Allison Nunn Premium Member over 14 years ago
he just wants the roads so he can more quickly move his “goods”…..
peter0423 over 14 years ago
Oh, yeah…infrastructure. :) Roads are critical to building a coherent society, yes. But the resources have to be there to build and maintain them, as well as secure them, or commerce will not result.
The Romans built their roads across their empire primarily for military purposes, and they imposed whatever taxes were needed to accomplish it. I wonder if the Afghans are ready for their central government to do that.
Nemesys over 14 years ago
Well, infrastructure has many dimensions. The Roman punishments weren’t any more frequent or cruel than anyone else’s at the time, and in fact can be considered more “civilized” than others since they had an beaurocratic and consistant method of administering them. As Havoc says, the crosses came along with the roads.
Funny how what goes around, comes around. Ever see those 5-star “Eisenhower Interstate System” signs on the highway? All we’re missing are the crosses…
Potrzebie over 14 years ago
The US ACE built their main highway a long time ago and then, they let it crumble to bits. We gave them fish instead of teaching them how to fish.
asa4ever over 14 years ago
The “Eisenhower Interstate System” did more to raise costs of produce than almost anything else. Trucks can not compete cost affectively with trains. Also how many small towns were destroyed by being bypassed by the highway system. Truck manafacturers, tire manufactuters and the oil companies were behind the highway system. Being retired anyway I try to take back roads when possible.
Wildcard24365 over 14 years ago
@Potrzebie
Fish?! Why fish, when you can grow opium? Far more profitable.
heeyuk over 14 years ago
The faster we go, the rounder we get.
lewisbower over 14 years ago
The interstate highway system did wonders for my city. One highway divided us along racial and income lines. Another separated the city from our river, a source of transportation and recreation. But the designers were thrifty, they built on cheaper municipal land, parks and open space. Now we hear the rumble of out of state traffic that neither stops for gas nor food but leaves a ton of pollutants. Nobody shops in the city now, it is too easy to stay away in the burbs and burn their gas.
SuperGriz over 14 years ago
The price of progress…
bradwilliams over 14 years ago
“Roads? Where we are going we don’t need roads.”
talewinds over 14 years ago
A turnpike of ‘roads’ scholars.
deadheadzan over 14 years ago
I thought the Romans crucified robbers and brigands to make the point that the roads were meant for honest travel and commerce.
freeholder1 over 14 years ago
And smog. Oh, sorry, greenie moment.
I’m from MI so anything that sells cars and gives them places to burn up lots of fuel going fast is fine with me. TX and MI share those interests. (;-)
Before, you couldn’t get to those small towns without hours of driving through other small towns with speed traps and 25 mph limits. One can still drive the “Irish Hills” into Detroit and spend many more hours that way than on the interstates. If you like it, it isn’t dead at all. Rt 66 made a great trip and TV show.
Ike created the freeways to open the land cause he saw the value of roads from his experience in WWII. We can now get to most places, even those dreaded small towns, very quickly and even a small access road and our fine new communications systems makes a cheap warehouse system viable. Ike even warned us about the military-industrial complex well in advance. One of our finest in service to his country all around.
The railway system still works, with it’s featherbedding, it’s separate worker’s comp system, it’s separate EVERYTHING. Not the pure capitalist solution it’s being made out to be here.
Lawrence Stetz Premium Member over 14 years ago
You should have seen the Roman’s punishment for political cartoonists. You were chained to a rock and had to explain every cartoon you drew to passers by.
Nemesys over 14 years ago
Eisenhower’s main purpose in funding and creating the Interstates was so that the government could ferry tanks and troops around at a moment’s notice, mobilizing against the imminent Soviet invasion. If it cut down on your ride to grandma’s house on Thanksgiving, so much the better.
Today’s Roman roads are the “Information Superhighway”, which was initially funded as a federal project to move data around between defense contractors. Sending personal e-mails, etc. was an afterthought. The Golden Arches have replaced the crosses on the highways… but where are the crosses on the internet highway?
NashvilleMac over 14 years ago
Give a whole new twist to the term “crossroads”, don’t it now?
freeholder1 over 14 years ago
Crosswalk.com for one. )))))
Romans actually stole the cross from the Persians who stole it from the Phoenicians who stole it from…Goes back as far as Taurus (T) worship and sacrificing humans on it for that God’s good graces. Roman never had an original idea but did a good job of stealing them from everyone else and “improving” them.
freeholder1 over 14 years ago
So cartooning was a Promethean effort even then, Timetraveler?
Justice22 over 14 years ago
Larry, The Interstate road system also made more produce available. Speaking of fresh vegetable produce, it is generally cheaper to transport to more places quicker through the Interstate system.
The Roman justice system was fairer than some today.
SuperGriz over 14 years ago
You’re silly.
NoBrandName over 14 years ago
Too late, Joe. I wasn’t sure what the translation was (though I suspected that was what it was) so I Googled it - and THIS PAGE was the 4th hit!
FriscoLou over 14 years ago
Can they withstand the siege?
http://bit.ly/cxWKwA
lindz.coop Premium Member over 14 years ago
SCAATY_423
“The Romans built their roads across their empire primarily for military purposes, and they imposed whatever taxes were needed to accomplish it. I wonder if the Afghans are ready for their central government to do that.”
Not sure the Americans are ready for a central government, let alone one that might impose taxes to accomplish building (or even maintaining) roads – the roads in Michigan are the worst in the country and there’s no money or will to fix them.
Quantumtorpedo1 over 14 years ago
The Japanese used crucifixion as a capital punishment also.