Very interesting. Scott has stated that Carmen is Hispanic, and so Winslow’s not entirely incorrect.
It’s one thing to say that, without Columbus, there would be no United States of America.
But I think it’s also fair to say, there was a whole lot of other stuff going on, caused by “discovery” of the Americas, from 1492 up and through at least 1864, that might have been better left undone.
Yes, I’m thinking of how the Europeans treated native peoples here on this continent, and not just the British. But I’m also thinking of the slave trade – and even the Spanish participated in that – heavily.
Columbus may be gone, but maybe it is time to rethink a lot of our history.
A lot of our history is not that pretty.
Even if we did get a half-way decent country out of it.
For the full-way decent country, let’s do something about racism and income inequality.
Maybe read up on Columbus’s brutal treatment of the natives on Hispaniola (including enslaving thousands and sending them away to Spain, forcing the rest to search for gold, and putting down revolts by having the leaders murdered and their bodies dragged through the streets) before you rush to put him on a pedestal?
Italians were oppressed much like Irish, Columbus was seized upon as a symbol to let them into the main stream. What’s a little genocide among white folk?
This just in, Fox viewers are old white people… https://www.pewresearch.org/fact-tank/2020/04/08/five-facts-about-fox-news/
But the Italian thing is so weird (and I’m Italian-American). Columbus was born in Genoa, but he sailed for Spain, worked for Spain, enriched Spain, and identified completely with Spain. He didn’t call himself “Cristoforo Columbo,” he called himself “Cristobal Colon.” He named his son “Diego.” And Genoa wasn’t even part of Italy at the time, it was an independent state.
He actually HURT Italy. Before Columbus, the Mediterranean was where all the trade routes were. After Columbus, trade moved to the Atlantic. Who had colonies in the New World? The Spanish, the French, the English, and the Dutch. The Italians had none. Columbus brought an end to 1500 years of Italian economic hegemony.
The notion of kicking Columbus out of his own holiday started back in 1977, at the United Nations’ International Conference on Discrimination Against Indigenous Populations in the Americas.
But Berkeley, California, was the first U.S. city to formally replace Columbus Day with Indigenous Peoples’ Day; its city council voted in the change in 1991 and it was first celebrated the following year in lieu of the Columbus Quincentennial, a nationwide celebration of the 500th anniversary of Columbus’ arrival in the Americas.
Two years later, Santa Cruz, California, joined Berkeley to replace Columbus Day with Indigenous Peoples’ Day. Then, in 2014, a small flood of cities, including Seattle and Minneapolis, joined these two progressive Bay Area towns.
In 2016, Denver joined in, followed by Los Angeles, Cincinnati, Atlanta, and San Francisco (which was the first city to celebrate Columbus Day), among others. (Here’s a complete list.) This year, even Columbus, Ohio, has cancelled its observation of Columbus Day.
✁
It’s not just cities. Four states also officially celebrate Indigenous Peoples’ Day instead of Columbus Day: Alaska, Minnesota, Vermont, and South Dakota (which calls it Native American Day). Nevada celebrates indigenous people on a different day than Columbus Day.
✁
The original promoters of the holiday, after all, were Italian immigrants of the early 20th century, who faced intense discrimination.
Angelo Noce, a first-generation Italian immigrant in Denver, convinced state lawmakers to adopt Columbus Day in 1907; federal recognition of the holiday came in 1937, following lobbying by the Knights of Columbus.
The Knights, a major Catholic fraternal organization, remain big Columbus Day boosters, not surprisingly.
Columbus Day no longer a state holiday in Colorado -Governor signs bill replacing holiday with Cabrini Day
Columbus Day has already been replaced in some cities. Boulder, for example, celebrates Indigenous Peoples Day. It started here hopefully it will end here.
Cheapskate0 about 4 years ago
Very interesting. Scott has stated that Carmen is Hispanic, and so Winslow’s not entirely incorrect.
It’s one thing to say that, without Columbus, there would be no United States of America.
But I think it’s also fair to say, there was a whole lot of other stuff going on, caused by “discovery” of the Americas, from 1492 up and through at least 1864, that might have been better left undone.
Yes, I’m thinking of how the Europeans treated native peoples here on this continent, and not just the British. But I’m also thinking of the slave trade – and even the Spanish participated in that – heavily.
Columbus may be gone, but maybe it is time to rethink a lot of our history.
A lot of our history is not that pretty.
Even if we did get a half-way decent country out of it.
For the full-way decent country, let’s do something about racism and income inequality.
Peace and love!
amethyst52 Premium Member about 4 years ago
Columbus didn’t discover America. It was already here.
Christopher Shea about 4 years ago
Maybe read up on Columbus’s brutal treatment of the natives on Hispaniola (including enslaving thousands and sending them away to Spain, forcing the rest to search for gold, and putting down revolts by having the leaders murdered and their bodies dragged through the streets) before you rush to put him on a pedestal?
William Robbins Premium Member about 4 years ago
Italians were oppressed much like Irish, Columbus was seized upon as a symbol to let them into the main stream. What’s a little genocide among white folk?
This just in, Fox viewers are old white people… https://www.pewresearch.org/fact-tank/2020/04/08/five-facts-about-fox-news/
Ignatz Premium Member about 4 years ago
But the Italian thing is so weird (and I’m Italian-American). Columbus was born in Genoa, but he sailed for Spain, worked for Spain, enriched Spain, and identified completely with Spain. He didn’t call himself “Cristoforo Columbo,” he called himself “Cristobal Colon.” He named his son “Diego.” And Genoa wasn’t even part of Italy at the time, it was an independent state.
He actually HURT Italy. Before Columbus, the Mediterranean was where all the trade routes were. After Columbus, trade moved to the Atlantic. Who had colonies in the New World? The Spanish, the French, the English, and the Dutch. The Italians had none. Columbus brought an end to 1500 years of Italian economic hegemony.
But the Italians have made him “our guy.”
Silly Season about 4 years ago
The notion of kicking Columbus out of his own holiday started back in 1977, at the United Nations’ International Conference on Discrimination Against Indigenous Populations in the Americas.
But Berkeley, California, was the first U.S. city to formally replace Columbus Day with Indigenous Peoples’ Day; its city council voted in the change in 1991 and it was first celebrated the following year in lieu of the Columbus Quincentennial, a nationwide celebration of the 500th anniversary of Columbus’ arrival in the Americas.
Two years later, Santa Cruz, California, joined Berkeley to replace Columbus Day with Indigenous Peoples’ Day. Then, in 2014, a small flood of cities, including Seattle and Minneapolis, joined these two progressive Bay Area towns.
In 2016, Denver joined in, followed by Los Angeles, Cincinnati, Atlanta, and San Francisco (which was the first city to celebrate Columbus Day), among others. (Here’s a complete list.) This year, even Columbus, Ohio, has cancelled its observation of Columbus Day.
✁
It’s not just cities. Four states also officially celebrate Indigenous Peoples’ Day instead of Columbus Day: Alaska, Minnesota, Vermont, and South Dakota (which calls it Native American Day). Nevada celebrates indigenous people on a different day than Columbus Day.
✁
The original promoters of the holiday, after all, were Italian immigrants of the early 20th century, who faced intense discrimination.
Angelo Noce, a first-generation Italian immigrant in Denver, convinced state lawmakers to adopt Columbus Day in 1907; federal recognition of the holiday came in 1937, following lobbying by the Knights of Columbus.
The Knights, a major Catholic fraternal organization, remain big Columbus Day boosters, not surprisingly.
~
https://www.bloomberg.com/news/articles/2018-10-08/columbus-day-is-out-indigenous-peoples-day-is-in
dotbup about 4 years ago
Columbus Day no longer a state holiday in Colorado -Governor signs bill replacing holiday with Cabrini Day
Columbus Day has already been replaced in some cities. Boulder, for example, celebrates Indigenous Peoples Day. It started here hopefully it will end here.
RobinHood about 4 years ago
“It’s my estimation that every man ever got a statue made of him was one kind of SOB or another.’
Malcolm Reynolds