Doonesbury by Garry Trudeau for November 22, 2012

Edgy satire! Stinging irony!

I guess they ran out of aspirins!

Marco Rubio:

“At the end of the day, I think there are multiple theories out there on how the universe was created and I think this is a country where people should have the opportunity to teach them all. I think parents should be able to teach their kids what their faith says, what science says. Whether the Earth was created in 7 days, or 7 actual eras, I’m not sure we’ll ever be able to answer that. It’s one of the great mysteries.”

Parents can teach their kids what the heck they like.

Schools should teach science in science lessons- the clue is in the name. I gather the US does not have Religious Education lessons in schools – this is a pity. RE isn’t about teaching kids what to believe, its where they learn about many belief systems. If you want to discuss competing creation myths, you need RE. This is perfectly compatible with the US being a secular state if the teaching is unbiased.

WHO is sponsoring this parade??

Agree with Grimmathe Nome; I suspect that one of the reasons the UK hasn’thad such a problem with conservative evangelicals is precisely because we DO teach about religions and their competing claims in school.

Georgia Republican Rep. Paul Broun, a physician who sits on the House Science, Space and Technology Committee:

“God’s word is true. I’ve come to understand that. All that stuff I was taught about evolution, embryology, Big Bang theory, all that is lies straight from the pit of hell. It’s lies to try to keep me and all the folks who are taught that from understanding that they need a savior. There’s a lot of scientific data that I found out as a scientist that actually show that this is really a young Earth. I believe that the Earth is about 9,000 years old. I believe that it was created in six days as we know them. That’s what the Bible says. And what I’ve come to learn is that it’s the manufacturer’s handbook, is what I call it. It teaches us how to run our lives individually. How to run our families, how to run our churches. But it teaches us how to run all our public policy and everything in society. And that’s the reason, as your congressman, I hold the Holy Bible as being the major directions to me of how I vote in Washington, D.C., and I’ll continue to do that.”

I think comparative religion should be taught in History class but kids should be released from school for an hour 1 or 2 days a week so they may go to their houses of worship for actual religious education.

In the spirit of equal time, Barak Obama said on April 13, 2008:

Q: Senator, if one of your daughters asked you—and maybe they already have—“Daddy, did god really create the world in 6 days?,” what would you say?

A: What I’ve said to them is that I believe that God created the universe and that the six days in the Bible may not be six days as we understand it … it may not be 24-hour days, and that’s what I believe. I know there’s always a debate between those who read the Bible literally and those who don’t, and I think it’s a legitimate debate within the Christian community of which I’m a part. My belief is that the story that the Bible tells about God creating this magnificent Earth on which we live—that is essentially true, that is fundamentally true. Now, whether it happened exactly as we might understand it reading the text of the Bible: That, I don’t presume to know.

This is me again. It’s not really about science and what is known about the age of the earth, nor is it about religion and how long those 6 days really were, in earth creation time. It’s about politicians answering science and religion questions politically. How can we expect any more than that from ANY politician?

For the whole story that I took the above quote from, click here. http://www.slate.com/articles/health_and_science/science/2012/11/rubio_and_obama_and_the_age_of_earth_politicians_hedge_about_whether_universe.html

We know how old the earth is: 4.5 billion years. Scientific dating methods have determined this.

The writing down of the Hebrew creation myth has been scientifically dated to be about 2300 years ago (in today’s Palestine/Israel with royal scribes writing the oral story down in ALPHABETICAL script under Judahite King Josiah)..

This Hebrew creation myth — in in ORAL form — depends on the much earlier Mesopotamian creation myth, dated about 10,000 years ago = about 8,000 BCE. It was not then written in ALPHABETICAL script, but in CUNEIFORM script (in today’s Iraq)..

Taxpayor-paid public schools should teach both the age of the earth and the “age of the myths” as scientifically determined IN SCIENCE CLASSES. They should also teach the content of the myths, not in science classes, but in COMPARITIVE RELIGION CLASSES.

Religion belongs in life, but not in government policy when government belongs equally to all. It was the influx of Roman Catholics into the U.S. that originally drove religion and prayer out of the schools. Protestants feared Roman Catholic doctrine being imposed on their kids, and Catholics feared Protestant doctrine. The only safe alternative was not to let either side teach or conduct prayers. Now, with greater detente between Catholics and Protestants, the probable is the large and growing number of non-Christians in the country. (And more power to them, I say: I hate monopolies.) Teaching about religion in schools would be a great idea (comparative religion, history of religion, etc., but not in science class), but there are too many people in this country who think that their religion is Religion, and everything else is not. How to keep religious or even atheist zealots out of religious education is the real problem. I remember with admiration the religion professors I studied with in college. The pious all thought them impious for their objective approach to the Bible (for example), but the skeptics and atheists in class all thought them religious because of the respect they showed for their subject matter.

Here is a partial list of SCIENTIFIC DATING METHODS:

• Superposition• Stratigraphy• Dendrochronology• Radiometric dating methods (scores of them, interlocking and extremely accurate)• Paleomagnetic / archaeomagnetic• Luminescence dating methods (several of them, all interlocking)• Amino acid racemization• Fission-track dating• Ice core dating• Varve dating• Pollen dating• Coral dating• Cation ratio dating• Fluorine dating• Patination• Oxidizable carbon ratio dating• Electron spin resonance• Cosmic-ray exposure dating

LOOK EACH OF THESE UP ON THE INTERNET USING GOOGLE SEARCH. Better yet, if you don’t already know about them, take university-level courses in them and how they work. Alternatively, get popular-level books, but only those written by scientists (who, like Carl Sagan, are able to communicate well to the layperson) or by qualified science writers such as Karl Zimmer. GOOD LUCK, KICK BUTT, AND “DON’T YOU LET NOBODY TURN YOU ROUND” (old Negro spiritual).

A place to start:

http://darwiniana.org/datingmethods.htm

Another excellent place to start is the online A SHORT COURSE IN SCIENTIFIC DATING METHODS:

http://archaeology.about.com/od/timingiseverything/A_Short_Course_in_Scientific_Dating_Methods.htm

Here are some course topics under A SHORT COURSE IN SCIENTIFIC DATING METHODS (online). More Dating Resources:

Stratigraphy and Seriation: An introduction to relative dating—the first ways used by archaeologists to tell how old one site, one part of a site, or one object is, relative to another

Chronological Markers and Dendrochronology: This lesson includes an introduction to absolute dating, as well as descriptions of the techniques using chronological markers and dendrochronology

.The Radiocarbon Revolution: An introduction to the first method developed using the measurement of biologrical processes.

New Fangled Methods: Dating techniques such as obsidian hydration, potassium-argon and fission track are not really new, except to an archaeologist, who believes anything under a century is new.

A Few Cautionary Notes: All dating techniques work to one degree or another; but all need to be used with some caution. Here’s why and how you can overcome the obstacles.

http://archaeology.about.com/od/timingiseverything/A_Short_Course_in_Scientific_Dating_Methods.htm

Another excellent internet resource for finding the truth about science, scientific dating, evolution, the scientific method, etc:

The TalkOrigins Archive: Exploring the Creation / Evolution Controversy.

http://www.talkorigins.org/

>> Are you in favor of his remark?I am strongly in favor of our electorate remaining aware of the superstitions that some let guide their decisions on policies that affect us all. I thought the quote I posted by Rubio showed a quaint fairy-tale view of the world, then I read what Coyoty posted quoting Rep. Paul Broun and now I’m shocked. On the Science, Space and Technology committee? Wow.

And how much time was spent cleaning up their poop?

Todd thought “legitimate” rape victims could not get pregnant. But, there are others who remain in Congress who also seem rather uninformed regarding Math and Science, regardless of committee…

Happy Thanksgiving everyone!

Take that you big poopy headed Republicans. Let this be the beginning of a ten thousand year reign by the Democrats.

As a Democrat, I am not looking for a 1000 year reign. Only a GOP that is with us now, in this century. If not, the voters will let them know that they need to wake up or become extinct. Unfortunately, the GOP still seems to be looking into voter suppression as a means of winning, rather than adapting, dare I say compromising?

GT was only referring to a quote by former GOP Congressman Todd Akin when he referred to rape in this strip. I am sure that GT is well aware of the fact that rape is a horrible crime. If I believed otherwise, I would never bother reading his strip.

Trudeau, it’s time for you to go. The 1970’s are over.

“Dr Kent Hovind, an authority on evolution and a true believer. He used to post6 a $250,000 reward on his website for anyone who could provide proof of evolution, might still to this day because it was never claimed.” Plus all the rest of your “picking and choosing” of SOME scientists’ historical mistakes.

Enough already with your being a patsy boy for the “talking points” of the fraudulent Discovery Institute in Seattle, Institute for Creation Research, the fraudulent Creation Museum near Petersburg, Kentucky (of the “Answers in Genesis” webmeister Ken Ham and his fraudulent “prize money”).

Michael Behe’s anti-scientific DARWIN’S BLACK BOX has been disproven in a court of law . . . .

I don’t want or need to go on at length about these tired old fundamentalist-creationist hoaxes that you’re reciting, Kerovan. But I will if you force my hand.

You have zero credible evidence against organic, Darwinian evolution (of the "modern synthesis). So GIVE IT A REST AND ENJOY YOUR THANKSGIVING. AND QUIT TRYING TO DECEIVE THESE GOOD FOLK ON DOONESBURY GOCOMIX.

The original Christian religion (and still going strong) has a simple answer to the question of the accuracy of the bible. When asked, Father Kroll had a simple answer – ‘Allegory’.

The Bible teaches religion, not science. The Bible does not answer questions about astronomy, evolution, genetics, physics, or electricity. Science does not answer questions about how many Gods there are, where (or if) heaven exists.

Just because the bible does not discuss evolution does not invalidate the science supporting the theory OR the teachings of the bible. Just because science has been unable to demonstrate the existence of a soul does not invalidate the teachings of faith found in the bible OR the teachings of science.

Far as I can tell, Serious Biblical Scholars date the Genesis 1 creation story to the time of the Babylonian exile, and view it not as a “history” but as a “hymn”—a statement of faith, not to be taken as a literal account. The similarity to the much older Sumerian myth is very likely intentional, effectively re-interpreting the older myth (in which the current world comes into being through a series of couplings and battles between various deities, and humans are at most intended to be slaves to the gods) in the monotheistic Hebrew context (these things were all done by a single God who loves his creation).

Taking this hymn as a literal history is not just bad science, it’s bad theology, because it effectively misses the forest (the message about the nature of God and the relationship between creator and creation) for the trees (the details of what happened when and how long it took).

Just about every mainstream Christian denomination (including Catholicism and Protestant denominations other than Southern Baptist) take the view that Gen. 1 is not to be taken as a literal history or scientific statement, and that evolution is not incompatible with scripture.

It’s a shame this doesn’t get reported as often as it should. Imagine what would happen if the press reported, “Candidate X, in open defiance of his own church’s doctrine, claimed that the earth was created in six days, five thousand years ago.” Wouldn’t that be fun?

Edgy & unexpected - me likey. :)

“… how sweet it is being a being of reason who embraces science and math instead of a tea bagging dodo elephant headed for extinction.”

It is equally sweet to be “a being of reason who embraces science” and also is able to support a belief in God, as I do. I believe that God created evolution.

I remember when I was a kid, we actually were released for an hour on Fridays for “church school”. The bus was paid for by the churches involved and every thing was hunky dory. I think the program ended because there was a lack of attendance, not anything to do with the constitution.

Intolerant, dogmatic, and addicted to Chick tracts is no way to go through life, son.

All politics aside, I hope you have a wonderful day today. May you have the comfort of knowing that there are people who care about you.

lol lol lol! Everything you copied/pasted. Debunked. Repeatedly. For years.

The “culture wars” will probably always be with us. I see where there is a movement among OB-GYNs to allow selling of oral contraceptives OTC. About time. It is a drug that is not without risks (so is aspirin), but the benefits would far outweigh this. But, I can hear it now— oh, that is not a solution- some will say. Yes, it is. And we need to get beyond this tired argument so that women can truly function as they should be able to, without the chains they now have. Without the concern about having to go through the very undesirable experience of having an unwanted pregnancy and/or abortion.

Any room in the parade for those who believe gun control laws prevent crime? Or that minimum wage laws do not increase unemployment?

Far from oral contraceptives causing problems, oral contraceptives are often used as preventive means aside from the obvious preventive pregnancy benefit. Many women need oral contraceptives for various reasons besides bc. Also, there are many studies which are now showing the added benefit of many women not having such a high risk of cancer, after extended use of oral contraceptives.

I know the right wing seems to wish to solve the problem of unwanted pregnancy in a different way— force those young girls to continue those pregnancies— that way couples who can’t have children can benefit— sorry, these are two separate issues. It should not be the problem of the young pregnant girl in difficult circumstances to solve the issue of infertility for someone else unless she chooses to do so.

The report I saw on oral contraceptions going OTC was on CNN. CNN reported this from the American College of Obstetricians and Gynecologists.

Good luck going up against the American College of Obstetricians and Gynecologists if you think you know better about women’s bodies. I am putting my money on ACOG.

Belief is easy. Anyone can do it. You can change to a completely different belief on odd-numbered days. Science is hard. Only people who have the patience to do research, building up facts, can do it. The test of science is that is hangs together, doesn’t invoke miracles to fill in the gaps, and can be refined as new facts come to light. Science is not written in stone; it is written in math.

I am sure that the “Bible” was written from the voice of God. He told the story in a way that the people of the time could understand. This is obvious throughout the holy book. There are many things man can not understand, he doesn’t have the capacity to do so. There will be many surprised people on judgement day. I am sure that I will be surprised, but I am leaving the understanding what we will be to that time.

so if ANY one of the GOP says anything, it means the whole GOP says it or is behind it? GOOD!!

Then the democrats think islands will tip over, there are 57 states, and the mars rover can go to where the astronauts landed on mars!!!

And apologies, should have remembered – Happy Thanksgiving, to those for whom it is…

But then, hey, none of you wished us a happy Bonfire Night…

Too far, Trudeau, too far.

Has anyone ever noticed that comments about this strip tend uniformly to be spelled and punctuated correctly…?

mt, I don’t know anything about ACOG, but from what I’ve seen, a lot of times the push to make prescription drugs OTC comes from insurance companies who don’t want to cover them…

To the victor belongs the spoils! Eat fact, Republicans!

BENGHAZI-G8 is shorter.

If they taught metaphysics in schools, perhaps people would realize that religion and science don’t contradict each other, because they are talking about different things with a limited vocabulary.

Sorry, mistated the Standard: GEographic, Political, Historical, Economic, Religious, and Social Cultures.Spells Gephers, with the first 2 letters the GE in geography.

I can imagine a lot more teens forking over a little more $ at the drugstore to get effective bc more easily than going to a doc and getting a prescription, covered or not. The choice isn’t between being on bc or not being on bc, it is between being on bc or not being on bc and risking pregnancy. Pregnancy causes far more health risks than being on bc, not to mention being a major upset in a person’s life if it is an unplanned pregnancy.

Let’s see. I’m grateful for my family, my country, my prez, and of course, Doonesbury. Thanks Mr. Trudeau, for all you do. As a write this, I am sure I am leaving out a lot of stuff. My apologies.

Happy Thanksgiving to all. And happy Buy Nothing Day tomorrow!

“… economics isn’t a part of liberals’ reality.”

False premise.

I agree that while Todd Akin was out campaigning, a village was missing their idiot. But an ignorant Republican would still have been better than any Democrat, especially one that is fully cognizant of the damage that she is doing. About one third of Missouri voters supported Akin because they knew that any extremist legislation he introduced would be shot down by the other members of Congress. On the other hand, if McCaskill won, she would rubber stamp anything put before her by her Democrat masters even if it meant putting the U.S. another 10 Trillion in debt. She shouldn’t be celebrating a victory over Akin. She should be wondering why she didn’t beat him by a much larger margin given his well publicized idiotic blunders.